On Tue, 12 Jul 2011 18:33:41 +0000 (UTC) 123hop at comcast.net writes:
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Wojtek S" <wsoko52 at gmail.com>
>
> [WS:] The last time I checked, radical leftists aiming to wipe out
> the capitalist state got themselves wiped out by the fascist
> reaction
> (cf. Spain and Italy), whereas moderate socialists and social
> democrats aiming to gain concessions from capitalists achieved a
> remarkably long lasting, if moderate, institutional successes (e.g.
>
> the Scandinavian welfare state - which certainly is not chopped
> liver.) I understand that bread and butter for the proles are
> beneath
> the concern of academic purists or self-styled radicals who do not
> have to earn their own living - but at least let's be honest about
> the
> outcomes, whatever their ideological value.
>
> ----------
>
> This is disingenuous at best. The welfare state rose in the shadow
> of the Soviet Union and upon the rubble of (temporarily) defeated
> fascism, and now that the threat of communism is gone, they are
> dismantling it as fast as they can, everywhere.
Well, Wotjek is correct that the Scandinavian welfare state was one of the great political success stories of the 20th century, but Joanna is correct to point out that it arose in the shadow of the Soviet Union, which in the case of the Scandinavian countries, was a nextdoor neighbor.
In the case of Sweden for instance, the rise of the welfare state can be tracked down to the early 1930s. The Social Democrats had been in office for a time in the 1920s but were swept out of power by the end of that decade. Then Sweden got hit by the Great Depression. As a consequence, strikes broke out, civil unrest developed, and for a while, the country seemed to be tottering on the brink of civil war. Then, a general election was held and the Social Democrats made a big comeback. Many of the younger members of the party made no secret of the fact that they sought inspiration from the October Revolution. The leaders of the Social Democrats, however, were mostly moderates, and they were able to broker a compromise with the country's capitalist class. In return for promising to keep Sweden's economy in private hands, the Social Democrats were pretty much given free reign to construct, what over time, was an increasingly generous welfare state. The existence and example of the Soviet Union, which was as I said before a close neighbor, was lost on no one. Most likely, the kind of political compromise that the Social Democrats were able to broker with the capitalists would not have been possible without the existence of the Soviet Union.
Jim Farmelant http://independent.academia.edu/JimFarmelant www.foxymath.com Learn or Review Basic Math
>
> Joanna
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