As Doug pointed out in one of his earliest posts on this thread, the whole dispute is generated by those whose moral sensibilities are roughed up by "speculation" and who think "production" is good. That is, the distinction is precisely a moral not an economic distinction, and moral distinctions are grounded in a false epistemology -- that is they assume that moral statements can be grounded and they can't.
Carroil
-----Original Message----- From: lbo-talk-bounces at lbo-talk.org [mailto:lbo-talk-bounces at lbo-talk.org] On Behalf Of Peter Fay Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 11:42 AM To: lbo-talk at lbo-talk.org Subject: Re: [lbo-talk] An Orgy of Speculation?
Seems this would be true in 1880's manufacturing, but not today, except for perhaps sectors that have recent high productivity growth - electronics, communications, maybe pharma, etc.
And if I'm not mistaken, this problem was Engel's observation (being a mfg. bean counter) rather than Marx's discovery - not that there's much difference. And seems the <19 November 1869> letter was Engels to Marx ("Dear Moor"), not Marx to Engels. Sorry, can't view other cites, as I don't have Penguin Capital, only International, nor your book (yet).
On Tue, Mar 8, 2011 at 11:15 PM, michael perelman < michael.perelman3 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Marx repeatedly noted that new technology destroys capital values so
> rapidly that no factory covers its production costs (Perelman, 1987,
> Ch. 4; see Marx to Engels on 14 August 1851, in Marx and Engels, 1982,
> p. 424; Marx 1967, III, p. 114; and Marx, 1963, p. 65; Marx to Engels,
> 19 November 1869; in Marx and Engels, 1942, p. 270). He cited
> Babbage's example that frames for making patent net that sold for 1200
> pounds a few years hence, cost only 60 pounds (Marx, 1977, p. 528;
> Babbage, 1835, p. 286 and 214; see also Baumol and Willig, 1981; and
> Gaskell, 1833, p. 43: cited in Alberro and Persky, 1981).
>
>
>
> > Marx emphasized turnovers of capital more than depreciation of fixed
> capital
> > as a simplification. To him price and market value are secondary in the
> > general analysis of value-based profitability.
>
>
> --
> Michael Perelman
> Economics Department
> California State University
> Chico, CA
> 95929
>
> 530 898 5321
> fax 530 898 5901
> http://michaelperelman.wordpress.com
> ___________________________________
> http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk
>
-- Peter Fay http://theclearview.wordpress.com ___________________________________ http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk