[lbo-talk] (The 23%...)

shag carpet bomb shag at cleandraws.com
Wed Feb 22 17:56:00 PST 2012


i think it's all related for Graeber, but what you describe isn't specific to cops. my director does this stuff all the time. and, unlike cops, he doesn't have an entire cultural mythology suggesting that the life of the cop isn't 80% mundane stuff like shuffling paper, directing traffic, etc. Interestingly, at the end of the book, Graeber points out that we export this cultural mythology of cops, the lone wolf who breaks all the rules and oerates outside of the context of bureaucracy, to the entire world.

also of interest is his argument that the natural result of a political ontology of violence is terrorism.

Oh, he also argues, and I wonder what people think about this, that:

1. the anti-capitalist insurrections throughout the 90s and very early 00s were successful. 2. global elites were challenged and terrified at this successful global resistance. 3. Afghanistan, Iraq was the response for a global elite terrified that movements had successful rewritten neo-liberal hegemony.

(War with Iran, on this view, is very likely going to be the result if Occupations continue unabated this Spring)

At 09:26 AM 2/22/2012, Wojtek S wrote:
>Shag: "Graeber has a fascinating analysis of all this in terms of what he
>calls a Political Ontology of the Imagination v Political Ontology of
>Violence. (Speaking of, I really like his explanation of how cops are
>simply low level bureaucrats with guns, which is a good way to
>understand their behavior.)"
>
>[WS:] I think he does much better when he talks about cops wanting to
>"define the situation" (in the section why cops hate puppets) - which
>does not have much to do with them being bureaucrats with guns. It
>has something to do with the fact that in any situation defining the
>situation is a crucial element of making other people to "go with the
>program."
>
>Katz ("Seductions of Crime") demonstrates that by studying crime,
>especially stick up. A successful stick up is when everyone,
>including the victims, accept the definition of the situation as a
>stickup, and consequently plays the respective role. Any disruption
>poses a threat to defining the situation the way the robbers (or cops
>or Carrol Cox ;) for that matter) want, and thus foils their plans. A
>good example of it is in one of the Woody Allen films in which a would
>be bank robber hands a stick-up note to the teller in which he
>misspells the word "gun" ("I have a gub"). The tellers starts asking
>him and then everyone around 'What is a gub?"
>
>I did not notice Graeber citing Katz on this, but he should have. I
>find Katz's argument far more developed than Graeber's simple state
>bashing. But he makes an excellent point why cops hate puppets, which
>can be extend to some of the behaviors on this list as well ;).
>
>Wojtek
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