On Wed, 13 Sep 2000 17:50:31 -0400, kelley <kwalker2 at gte.net> wrote:
>
>> I learned programming apprentice style, by reading other
>> programmers's code for effectiveness and elegance. Note that
>> I did not always succeed in my attempt at elegance, but I
>> tried.
>
> being a sociologist is an art.
well, being me, i *have* to say that neither one are exactly *science,* so...
> i'll repeat b/c i don't think posts got to list:
>
> 1. there are claims made about how special progtramming is b/c
> it's an art and embedded in a set of social rel. that may somehow
> be potentially revolutionary. feh. do you know how many
> occupations made the same claims?
well, if these claims have been made, they are bullshit. like i said before, coders aren't leaving their computers long enough to lead the revolution. hell, they aren't even likely to be aware that there is (or needs to be) a revolution. nor do coders have anything that is likely to filter down to the rest of the population, save money. so feh back at ya...
> 2. there is a failure to examine the claims made as to its
> supposed "caring and sharing" culture in so far as there IS and
> HAS been until i said something, an assumption that coding is
> somehow unsullied by the more mundane aspects of life on planet
> earth. double feh. now, why is it that anyone is supposed to get
> all doe-eyed about any of this? eh?
not exactly true. the claims are taken with a grain of salt by the community itself. perhaps the problem is that *other* people believe them...
> 3. while there is nothing wrong with giving and sharing, but i
> was asking for a little more reflexivity about claims that this is
> primary motivation.
and this is the problem. the primary motivation is more likely to be need than to be "dick-slinging" or emergent professionalism.
> i am suspicious of a male dominated occ. and this insistence on
> the claim, "we're special b/c we give things away and want to be
> recognized for it".
sic. what the hell am *i* missing. perhaps *i* haven't removed my head from the computer long enough...
raymond making a lecture tour or something???
> also, my sensors are cued to this b/c as i expl'd to peter, this
> is one of the fundamental signs of an unorganized set of practices
> (an art) becoming professionalized and formalized. i'm not
> blowing smoke here--this is well documented in the literature.
so you are trying to suggest that something that has basically *just* emerged (not altogether true, but it is apt for outside of academia) in the last 8 years is already becoming professional? hmmm, then we really *did* change the world!
> 5. yes. it's beautiful. but there is a disconnect and some odd
> inability to see that this goes for any number of other things one
> can do for a living that one can find extremely fulfilling. i
> used to cook. a pastry chef. i learned the craft tradition way
> too. no school. i loved it. i used to love to make wedding
> cakes. i *never* made them for a profit and indeed never even
> asked people to pay me for the cost of making it. i did them for
> free because i loved doing it, loved making something beautiful,
> and loved the symbolic significance of the gesture and the cake
> itself. and i got something out of it. as you say, "so what?"
>
> but i don't run around pretending or claiming that my former
> occupation is somehow going to be part of the coming revolution.
so you are suggesting that the networked environment *isn't* different? that it *isn't* changing not only how work (and play) is getting done, but *who* is getting rewarded for it? oh, come on. geez, 25 years ago, people would tell you that the path to a higher standard of living was a college education. now that is a secure path to flipping burgers, not a higher sol.
i think you are taking written sources more seriously than you should. hacker/coder dom is still a verbal culture. the documentation sucks. who has time? you ought to be more circumspect about what you read...
ac
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| the geek shall |
| inherit the earth |
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ooO Ooo
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