I am not adopting all of Yoshie's ideas or criticisms of Dennis. I am point out that a lot of progressive groups are careful not to use the term "citizens" when organizing--especially immigrant rights groups.
A lawyer on the list can help me out (I am not a lawyer - ABA disclaimer) but as I understand it, the following list in order starts with the most rights and then for each step certain rights and priveleges are reduced:
U.S. Citizens Documented persons physically in the US Undocumented persons physically in the US
All three groups comprise all "US persons" under the law, and certain basic rights protect all.
-Chip
----- Original Message ----- From: "kelley" <kwalker2 at gte.net> To: <lbo-talk at lists.panix.com>; <lbo-talk at lists.panix.com> Sent: Saturday, October 06, 2001 11:40 AM Subject: citizenship
> At 11:26 AM 10/6/01 -0400, Chip Berlet wrote:
> >Um, Dennis, in the civil liberties community the phrase "US persons" is used
> >precisely because it refers to all persons present in the US and not just
> >citizens.
> >
> >Yoshie is raising issues of language that are commonly discussed in the human
> >rights community as well.
> >
> >Wake up and smell your rhetoric...
> >
> >-Chip
>
>
> i have question: if a person lives in US aren't they entitled to all the
> rights of a citizen? or, rather, are supposed to be given the discourse of
> citizenship and rights that the C and BoR is founded on?
>
> otherwise, Dennis made a mistake, a slip. He's quite aware of the issues
> involved as far as I can see. It would be like me taking to task every
> single man on this list every single time they say something similar.
> Yoshie is now on to another issue, the use of fascism.
>