On Sat, 2 Mar 2002, Justin Schwartz wrote:
> The "debate" was pretty stupid.
Granted. Whether it exemplifies the current state of the Democratic Party seems to be another issue.
> What the guys point about the "North"
> Vietnese was was unclear, and the answer that the NVA had the "fifth"
> largest military force in the world was utterly lame if it was supposedto
> explain or justify how that force beat the militarily mightest nation in
> recorded history. Be that as it may.
What, you would've preferred that we kill everyone in Vietnam? Why any leftist would guffaw at America's inevitable failure (a worthless goal pursued with the most ruthless of means) is beyond me. Tears are a more fitting response.
> Clinton's gesture is typical, a symbolic nothing ("I feel your pain"); it
> would be more impressive from someone who had not abolished welfare,
> repealed habeas corpus, ensconced Reaganism has the ruling philosophy of the
> DP, and rammed through GATT and NAFTA, meanwhile launching cruise missiles
> at random to distract from his domestic embarassments.
Yep, sure, and snickers are also empty until backed by a substantive critique. Somehow, I think even your laundry list falls just short (I don't personally think of NAFTA, GATT, and Kosovo as an "axis of evil"). The Wag the Dog bit was refuted in the New Yorker at the time: existing policy proscribed cruise missile attacks against Iraq the next time weapons inspectors were turned away.
In any event, all this is tiresome and divorced from my origninal limited point: Clinton's gesture (emtpy or otherwise) tells us little on its own about the man and next to nothing about his party.
> I miss Richard Nixon. For all his creepy personality and attacks on the
> Constitution he did more good for this country in any week in office than
> Clinton did in eight years.
Question: why wouldn't progressive like Kuttner say something like that? Wishful thinking?
All the best from gloomy Oxford, Luke
> jks
>
> >
>
> > >
> > > -- Dennis
> > >
> > > -------------------------------
> > > Copyright 2002 Associated Press
> > > AP Worldstream
> > > HEADLINE: Security guards toss heckler out of Clinton speech
> > > DATELINE: BRISBANE, Australia
> > > BODY: Security guards forcibly removed a heckler from a charity dinner
> >Friday
> > > after he stood up and began arguing with former U.S. President Bill
> > > Clinton.
> > >
> > > The man, a paid guest at the black-tie dinner, was carried out of the
> > > function attended by 700 people after a verbal clash with Clinton. Seven
> > > minutes into Clinton's speech, the man, whose identity was not
> >immediately
> > > released, began objecting to the former president's comments on the war
> > > against terrorism and said that the United States had been beaten in the
> > > Vietnam war.
> > >
> > > "Hang on, North Vietnam beat you. They shot you down," the man shouted.
> > >
> > > Unfazed, Clinton pointed out that North Vietnam had the fifth-biggest
> >Army
> > > in the world.
> > >
> > > "The Viet Cong were the terrorists," he said.
> > >
> > > As the heckling continued and other guests told the man to sit down and
> >be
> > > quiet, Clinton invited him to address the dinner in his place.
> > >
> > > "I'd be happy for you to give this speech. I've been talking every
> > > night. I'm tired," he said. Clinton is on a speaking tour of Australia.
> > >
> > > Security guards moved in to take the heckler away, but Clinton urged
> >them
> > > to let him stay.
> > >
> > > "Be nice to him. Listen, most of these things are highly
> > > predictable. Don't throw him out," Clinton said. "Let him sit down. Just
> > > sit down and have a good time. Relax, chill out."
> > >
> > > But as the interruptions continued, guards moved in and carried the man
> > > out.
> > >
> > > It was not immediately clear if the man would be charged with any
> >offense.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
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