From: "Michael Dawson"
^^^^^ CB: Most people don't think the law has some special injunctive force because it was passed by good procedures.
I don't quite get the confusion in this thread. Of course people don't normally walk around thinking about political theory when they obey or break laws. And of course most people "obey laws" in most cases because many good laws merely codify ordinary ethical conduct, which, despite our hugely screwed up and amoral power structure, remains quite widespread among the commoners.
Despite all this, it remains true that, ultimately, people do subscribe to or reject laws because of the fairness of the procedures that create them. Foucault was wrong. It is not all arbitrary corruption and power. Reality exists, and people are able, under certain hard-to-obtain conditions, to make and enforce fair laws that arise from observation and debate of reality.
^^^^^^ CB: Hello Michael, welcome back.
The confusion here is due to the fact that, evidently, people have diametrically opposed and contradictory conclusions from their experience with the law. I can't understand at all how you can say
" ...it remains true that, ultimately, people do subscribe to or reject laws because of the fairness of the procedures that create them"
I know I don't think that. My brother doesn't think that. None of my friends think that. I don't know _any_body who thinks that. So, at best it would be "some people". Maybe I should say "some people" too. But I gotta say most. I just can't imagine many people thinking about the "procedures" by which a law was passed rather than what might happen to them or their money or job.
Every court room I have been in is has at least one officer with a gun there.