At 07:45 PM 6/19/2005, Carrol Cox wrote:
>For it is simply false. Almost all leftists have always been more than
>willing to work with -- in fact have worked with -- any xtians who were
>engated in struggling for progressive causes. What are you talking
>about?
this is so true, it ain't funny. if you actually work in leftist orgs, all you ever do is work with religious people: catholics, protestants, you name it, were involved in everything from pro-choice organizing, working with single mothers with a feminist org in town, labor organizing, the plant closing legislation organizing that went on in the eighties, anti-nuclear proliferation, antiwar during Gw1, antiwar now,
ok, "all you ever do" is over the top, but what i mean is that leftist reach out to religious groups all the time, via coalition building, because they actively seek out groups with whom to work, etc.
no one makes fun of religious people when you're organizing, protesting, whatever. most people are very respectful and many people are vaguely religious themselves, or celebrate christmas or major holidays, etc. what could it possibly bother anyone to be in a roomful of religious people.
no one says, "hey, what the heck you doing here, you religious freak."
no one thinks it's odd that they'd join. as egocentric lefties, we think it's natural that they want to lend their support to pro-choice rallies, pitch in money for the pro-choice ad, sign their church's name or their name as pastor/deacon, do clinic defense, organize against a war, support labor activism, fight against the death penalty.
of course they'd be there. in my old hometown, if you wanted to get anything started, the first place you went was to a church to get the support of people you the various liberal churches in town who naturally what you were working on.
Oh. Jeez, I just remembered: we always MET in a church for just about anything I have ever participated in!
anyway, i actually have a gig so i need to shut up and work.
and i don't mean only unitarians. in fact, the only time i was in a unitarian church was when i used to take care of children -- I was volunteering for.. group i can't recall .. an a AA type support group for parents who were having a hard time dealing with their children.
Michale's post was interesting, but it just didn't make a lot of sense to the question I thought was asked: Why dont they help themselves.
The one point I thought most salient was this: they aren't inclined to get involved in the first place. it's not an identity politics for them.
this is born out in Alan Wolfe's work, _One Nation Under God_, in _Habits of the Heart_, and I'm sure other empirical studies. Central to these religious viewpoints is an allegiance to the idea that you shouldn't force your views on others. Religion is a private affair and that's it.
k
"Finish your beer. There are sober kids in India."
-- rwmartin