[lbo-talk] We can lose, or we can just lose later

boddi satva lbo.boddi at gmail.com
Mon Nov 28 10:46:01 PST 2005


Notice the order in which they are listed: constitution then laws then treaties.

No accident.

QED

Immoral, yes, and you bear the responsibity for sending your troops to fight it as much as any citizen. They are your agents. But illegal? No. You sent your troops to Iraq through a well-established legal process.

Congress and the administration make laws that are found to be treaty violations all the time. European countries are found to violate the treaties that form the EU all the time and that is halfway to a federal state.

Should American troops revolt because of the Canadian softwood lumber dispute? Because America was disciplined by the WTO? There is a well-understood process of law for dealing with claims by co-signatory powers that we have violated treaty obligations and it does not include mutiny of soldiers.

Meanwhile, if you can get hold of it I recommend to everybody try and look at the 2-part episode of the Fred Friendly/Columbia U/PBS series "Ethics in America" called "Under Orders, Under Fire". It works through a lot of the ethical issues of the military with a host of luminaries.

boddi

On 11/28/05, Yoshie Furuhashi <furuhashi.1 at osu.edu> wrote:
> boddi satva lbo.boddi at gmail.com
> Mon Nov 28 01:07:38 PST 2005:
>
>
> > Yeah, I forgot, Kofi Annan is President and Chief Justice of the
> > Entire World.
> >
> > This may be news to you but the UN is not a world government and no
> > reasonable person thinks it is. Did you vote for Kofi Annan? I
> > didn't. How many of the governments represented at the UN are even
> > democratic? How many of them represent the will of their people?
> >
> > When Kofi Annan says that something is "illegal" he's talking
> > rubbish. What he is actually saying is that according to part of
> > the UN the United States government has violated the terms of a
> > treaty. First, that's hardly the final word on the subject. Second,
> > treaties are not sovereign over elected legislatures.
>
> Article VI of the United States Constitution says: "This
> Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made
> in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made,
> under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of
> the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any
> Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary
> notwithstanding."
>
> The Iraq War, which violates the UN Charter to which the United
> States is a signatory, is illegal and immoral.
>
> Yoshie Furuhashi
> <http://montages.blogspot.com>
> <http://monthlyreview.org>
> <http://mrzine.org>
>
>
> ___________________________________
> http://mailman.lbo-talk.org/mailman/listinfo/lbo-talk
>



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